Travelling by love, loss, and letting go in Hamaguchi’s “Drive My Automobile”

Right now we’re talking with Azusa Yamazaki, the editor of Drive My Automobile, which gained an Oscar for Greatest Worldwide Function Movie and a BAFTA for Greatest Movie Not within the English Language. Azusa has edited quite a few function movies, together with Asako I & II, Dream of Illumination, and The Ark within the Mirage.

She has additionally reduce a number of TV sequence in her native Japan. Our dialogue was by an interpreter—Naoki Tanaka—who’s a pal of Azusa’s from movie college.

Try the Artwork of the Reduce podcast to listen to this interview, and keep updated on all the most recent episodes.

This text is an in-depth dialogue of Drive My Automobile and will include spoilers and plot reveals for many who have but to observe the film.

HULLFISH: What’s your method to a brand new scene when the dailies or rushes are available? What do you do first?

YAMAZAKI: After I obtain new rushes, new dailies, for this venture I had an assistant, in order that they undergo the brand new rushes and set up them for me first. After my assistants have put collectively the rushes, I watch them from starting to the tip and I maintain notes. I make an inventory as I watch the day’s footage.

HULLFISH: Do you watch in a selects reel or watch particular person takes?

YAMAZAKI: So usually, with a Mr. Hamaguchi movie, in a method there’s no idea of a “not good take.” Each take is a risk. So until there’s a technical downside that’s completely, clearly not good, I watch each single shot that’s been taken. So the assistants will re-order the scene in sequential order of the story. However I watch it from the start to the tip, not choosing, simply watching the entire thing by from starting to finish.

HULLFISH: Making handwritten notes or placing markers within the timeline?

YAMAZAKI: Normally, my method of taking notes could be very analog. I imply, generally iPads, however often I like to jot down down what I feel or what I’ve observed as I watch the rushes.

HULLFISH: Is it a typical workflow the place you’ll edit an editor’s reduce and present it to the director? Or do you’re employed with the director even throughout manufacturing?

YAMAZAKI: Usually talking with Mr. Hamaguchi, it’s somewhat completely different than working with different administrators. Usually, if I’m working with one other director, I would work on the editor’s reduce whereas they’re taking pictures.

However with Mr. Hamaguchi it’s a really distinctive workflow the place they end their principal pictures, then he would come into the enhancing room and we might watch the rushes collectively. We generally spend days watching what now we have, so we begin collectively.

The explanation he likes to attend till they end filming is, as I stated earlier, he doesn’t have a nasty take. Each shot is a risk. So he likes to focus on the directing when he’s on set. He doesn’t prefer to suppose if that was a superb shot or a nasty shot.

“He doesn’t have a nasty take. Each shot is a risk.”

That’s why the workflow has changed into this type of “wait until we end filming” in order that he can think about his directing on set after which fear about which takes to make use of after. He’ll rewatch them and refresh his reminiscence. He’ll give it some thought. After which that’s when he decides if this was a superb take or a nasty take.

HULLFISH: Did you’re employed in any respect throughout manufacturing? Whereas they had been filming?

YAMAZAKI: Throughout manufacturing I don’t do any sort of enhancing. I don’t do any sort of enhancing behind his again both. Purely simply watching the rushes.

HULLFISH: Inform me somewhat bit concerning the construction of the movie. Are you able to consider any examples of scenes that had been rearranged from the script?

YAMAZAKI: So on this movie, we reordered some scenes for structural functions, but it surely’s one thing that doesn’t occur typically in Mr. Hamaguchi’s movies.

For instance, the very first scene of the movie the place his spouse is bedridden. That was not the unique starting of the movie. That was introduced in from some place else. In order that’s one of many examples that now we have altering the construction of the movie.

Initially, the primary scene was purported to be Oto, his spouse, recording her voice to the tape. It was a shot that was going to dolly as much as her again in a darkish room and she or he’s recording in a nook and the digital camera simply creeps up on her again. That was the unique opening of the movie.

Within the closing film, that authentic opening scene moved to simply earlier than touring to Hiroshima. So the primary purpose they moved Oto’s bedridden scene, bringing that to the opening is that the director determined. But in addition it’s her voice. It’s the best way she talked about her dream.

It was a really highly effective scene. And I consider that that was a part of the rationale that he determined this must be our opening scene.

HULLFISH: Are you able to discuss to me about one other rearrangement of scenes and why it was completed?

So we determined to maneuver it to the block the place they’re in Tohuku or the place they’re going to Tohuku, and that builds as much as them going to Hokkaido, the place they each shed a tear collectively. So it labored out in a really good method.

HULLFISH: Have been there any movies that the director requested you to observe or that the 2 of you watched collectively or mentioned as inspiration?

YAMAZAKI: Mr. Hamaguchi requested me to observe a number of the later works of Claude Chabrol. Particularly the place to chop, simply to concentrate on the place to chop, why and the place. He needed me to concentrate to these enhancing factors.

HULLFISH: What in these edits did you identify had been attention-grabbing or had been uncommon?

YAMAZAKI: What Mr. Hamaguchi needed me to concentrate to was how one can reduce motion. Tips on how to leap sure actions. In his movies usually, he’s very explicit about continuity.

So the motion must be flawless, seamless, and we spend plenty of time adjusting to get the best motion continuity. However for this movie, he needed me to concentrate to how one can leap, how one can make that reduce. That particularly was his curiosity for this movie. In order that’s why he needed me to observe Chabrol’s later works.

HULLFISH: Early on when Oto brings the younger actor in to see Kafuku’s efficiency and Kafuku is taking his make-up off. He says, “Oh, let me change garments.” And he begins to take his garments off, and it’s a tough reduce to him packing his suitcase. Is that a type of cuts that you just really feel is just like that.

YAMAZAKI: That exact scene or that individual edit that you just talked about was within the script to start with. This was a special situation. It wasn’t instantly impressed by his works. It was already written there by Mr. Hamaguchi.

HULLFISH: I didn’t discover any assistant editor jobs in your filmography, did you progress on to the editor’s chair?

YAMAZAKI: After all we do have assistant editors in Japan as effectively, so it actually comes right down to cash causes. Lots of the decrease funds movies in Japan don’t have sufficient funds to herald an assistant editor.

One of many causes I don’t have an assistant editor credit score is that, after graduating movie college I labored on a number of indie movies, and as I used to be doing that, one of many folks I used to be working with stated they’re going to work on a theatrical model of what they had been doing—a function size function movie of what they had been engaged on—so I bought on board with that movie after which grew to become an editor.

HULLFISH: Was there one thing that drew you to enhancing? Why did you determine this was a great way to be a filmmaker?

YAMAZAKI: To start with I used to observe plenty of commercials or movies and any sort of movies, and I assumed I needed to be a director. The conclusion got here once I was in faculty. I might watch varied movies and see particular enhancing methods that weren’t as easy in telling a narrative. Like leap cuts.

That’s once I first observed the significance of enhancing, and that’s actually simply what drew me into engaged on enhancing.

HULLFISH: Are there cultural understandings which can be essential to enhancing, or do you suppose that an American or European editor might have edited this movie?

YAMAZAKI: Possibly you do want some understanding of cultural backgrounds. However I additionally consider that you would be able to see or you possibly can really feel what’s on the display. You’ll be able to inform what’s occurring simply visually. So possibly you want some sort of a cultural background or an understanding, however I consider the picture tells the story.

“When you begin enhancing, the significance of cultural understanding simply will get smaller and smaller. It’s extra about visible storytelling.”

When you begin enhancing, the significance of cultural understanding simply will get smaller and smaller. It’s extra about visible storytelling, and I can solely assume that if an editor from one other tradition determined to edit this movie, I might think about that these characters can be extra expressive, possibly somewhat extra?

It’s solely my creativeness. I can’t say for positive, however I think about that’s what would occur if an editor from a special tradition checked out this movie.

HULLFISH: One of many explanation why I requested this query is due to this clip the place Kafuku meets Misaki, his driver, within the parking storage.

YAMAZAKI: So that you introduced up Misaki for example. There was an intention behind enhancing her scenes. We purposefully made her appear to be she had no emotion—extra like a robotic sort of individual. That was the intention of the edit.

So we particularly reduce out her blinking or chopping simply earlier than her line of sight shifts. We’d reduce simply earlier than she strikes her eyes. Little issues like that that we made to make her look sort of extra mechanical. No emotion.

Now, I don’t know if that pertains to cultural notion, however possibly it’s simply how Mr. Hamaguchi directs his movies. Possibly it’s simply his model.

HULLFISH: Let’s discuss concerning the worth of shot sizes and the way you select which kind of shot you’ll use for a specific second. Possibly you can provide an instance.

YAMAZAKI: Possibly a superb scene to speak about shot sizes is the dinner scene on the Yoon-su’s home. So in that scene, the hero of that scene is her signal language. Her hand motion is the hero of the scene. So we edited that scene primarily based on that being the hero.

“It’s like a puzzle. There’s a proper shot measurement, there’s a proper time to chop.”

We structured the scene to make that extra interesting. It’s a lovely shot. So we labored actually exhausting to make that shot stand out. And talking about structuring that scene or any scene in Mr. Hamaguchi’s movie, he believes there’s a proper piece to make that scene.

There’s an accurate piece to slot in. It’s like a puzzle. There’s a proper shot measurement, there’s a proper time to chop. And I don’t know the way it works, however as soon as we begin placing it collectively, this piece matches with this, this, this.

After which it’s simply discovering the best items and placing them collectively. And one extra observe to that’s this scene was impressed by Clint Eastwood’s Sully.

HULLFISH: And the way was it impressed by Sully?

YAMAZAKI: The inspiration got here from a convention room scene—and it occurs rather a lot in Clint Eastwood’s movie the place you have got so many characters in the identical room—however there’s at all times the best expression and the best individual to be on. And it occurs rather a lot. And that’s the place we tried to discover a clue of how one can make it occur.

HULLFISH: Typically the characters within the movie usually are not saying what they imply. The true which means is in subtext. How can the editor assist mildew or craft subtext or present it to an viewers?

YAMAZAKI: In order an editor, possibly we will create subtext by doing the small issues like choosing the right facial expressions of the actors or their small, delicate actions. Leaving that within the scene or possibly chopping them out. Possibly the period of the shot—when to chop is a crucial half as an editor to create the subtext.

“As an editor, possibly we will create subtext by doing the small issues like choosing the right facial expressions of the actors or their small, delicate actions.”

HULLFISH: As a result of when you maintain on the shot longer after the individual speaks, you understand that they’re considering one thing else?

YAMAZAKI: Possibly. That’s very noticeable within the scene we talked about earlier the place Kafuku takes off his make-up originally of the movie.

HULLFISH: Let’s check out this scene when Kafuku and the younger actor are having a bar dialog and the actor says, “Oto should have been very proud of a husband such as you.” Simply these selections of when to chop and who to be on and what measurement shot to be on.

YAMAZAKI: For this explicit bar scene, we tried many, many various variations. And this scene is possibly extra about how Mr. Hamaguchi constructions movie. Lots of it was what he envisioned greater than the enhancing per se. This scene particularly was extra primarily based on the director’s imaginative and prescient. I realized rather a lot by enhancing this scene.

HULLFISH: You stayed on the two-shot for some time. Clearly, when you needed to, you may reduce close-up, close-up, close-up. However there’s this alternative to make use of this two-shot. And what do you suppose the worth of the two-shot is, particularly to begin the scene?

YAMAZAKI: So the worth or the significance of this two shot—this wider shot—is displaying the gap between one individual to a different. So, for instance, Kafuku doesn’t wish to or he wouldn’t wish to mentally get any nearer to Takatsuki, the youthful actor.

Throughout their dialog, if Kafuku was or he confirmed any sort of curiosity in what Takatsuki, the younger actor, was saying, these had been the moments after we used closeups.

HULLFISH: One other place the place I might love to speak concerning the alternative of the shot measurement is there’s a dialogue by the ocean facet on these stairs the place they go to have a smoke. And it’s largely completed on this huge overhead shot. However it’s a really private dialogue, however there’s solely close-ups on the finish. Why have this private dialogue on this huge shot?

YAMAZAKI: This huge open overhead shot is the opening shot for this explicit scene. And it’s sort of Mr. Hamaguchi’s precept about enhancing. Each shot has an expiration date. There’s going to be a second the place you’re going to get uninterested in it otherwise you wish to transfer on. He believes that.

“Each shot has an expiration date.”

As a result of we’ve labored collectively earlier than, now we have a shared expertise regarding when is the best second to chop. We reduce to the close-up on the finish as a result of the second has come. That overhead shot, the shining second of that shot simply sort of expired at that second. So we moved to close-up.

We used the close-ups once they handed the lighter to one another. When there was any sort of motion, that’s after we used the close-up. However usually, we needed to maintain them collectively within the body.

The place of that was actually the cinematographer—Hidetoshi Shinomiya’s determination. It was the best determination by him to position it there in that angle, to maintain each of them in the identical body.

HULLFISH: There’s using a pre-lap audio. Once we go from the spouse’s funeral to the play, you hear the play whilst you’re nonetheless within the funeral scene. What’s the worth of a pre-lap?

YAMAZAKI: So on this movie we use the pre-lap on two completely different events for various causes. The primary scene you talked about the place you have got the spouse’s funeral, then you definately hear the sound of the play are available, and then you definately transfer on to the subsequent scene.

We use that sort of method after we wish to join the emotion between two scenes. We wish to carry over that character or the scene’s emotion to the subsequent factor.

I don’t know if seamlessness is the best phrase to make use of, however we wish to bridge these two scenes collectively. Change your emotion from one emotion to a different. That was one of many makes use of.

One other pre-lap that we used was a gunshot. And this was really going into the stage play. It was the reverse of what we did earlier. We needed to chop off any sort of emotion that you just felt, and we needed to snap you out of it and produce you into the subsequent scene. So identical method, however two completely different functions.

One other use of a pre-lap was Kafuku doesn’t say a lot. If we depart him on a shot the place he doesn’t say something, however you hear the rehearsal, you hear the opposite actors speaking within the background—what they are saying within the background they’re talking for him. That’s one other use that we attempt to accomplish. He doesn’t must say something however we let the movie converse for him.

HULLFISH: So some dialog from Uncle Vanya can be talking what’s in his thoughts?

YAMAZAKI: That’s proper. It helps the viewers join what’s stated within the play and what’s in actual life within the story. It helps the viewers perceive the 2 worlds.

HULLFISH: One of many final scenes within the film, we’ve sort of gone backstage with another actors they usually’re watching—within the inexperienced room or of their dressing room—they’re watching the play happen on a TV display, after which we comply with that by to the tip of the play. May you discuss to me about chopping that sequence?

YAMAZAKI: We didn’t strive many variations like we did with the opposite scenes. We ended up the place it’s fairly quick. So on this explicit scene, Mr. Hamaguchi doesn’t have a kind of a storyboard in his thoughts. He concentrates on the directing on set and he decides how he needs to place the movie collectively in his thoughts as we watch the rushes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y77FELZaE6c

HULLFISH: Most of this scene is performed on this ahead shot, trying on the two actors dealing with the digital camera as she’s signing behind him. It’s a really lengthy shot, interrupted by cuts to Misaki. Are you able to clarify the selection of when to go to a response shot? As a result of they’re used very sparingly.

YAMAZAKI: To sort of clarify how and after we reduce to Misaki and after we went again, usually we reduce to Misaki when the dialogue of that scene hits her actually exhausting. When that dialogue means one thing to Misaki we reduce to her after which we present sufficient of her response after which return to persevering with the dialogue.

The best response comes in the direction of the tip of the play. That was usually using the response photographs for Misaki. We additionally confirmed the huge shot of the viewers early on in order that the movie’s viewers knew that Misaki was within the viewers to observe the play. It’s simply data.

However because the play strikes alongside, that shot begins to play a special position within the scene. However particularly, we tried to keep away from an apparent reduce the place dialogue would instantly have an effect on Misaki’s feelings. That was not the aim. So we tried to keep away from the plain.

HULLFISH: There’s a large shot of the play after which there’s a large shot of the viewers. I used to be considering that you just’d wish to present the viewers earlier than you began displaying close-ups of Misaki. Is that true? Did you are feeling such as you wanted to arrange the viewers earlier than you noticed a person viewers member?

YAMAZAKI: One factor was simply to clarify the place we’re and what’s occurring. That’s one massive purpose. Misaki is in that huge shot, but it surely’s too early to function her on this scene. We simply needed to arrange the scene that it is a play and the viewers are right here to observe the play. It wasn’t the best second to convey her in as a featured character within the scene.

HULLFISH: The film is kind of lengthy and there’s plenty of driving. What’s the goal of displaying tunnel scenes and the driving scenes and going to locations when you may simply reduce to them arriving at Misaki’s outdated hometown. However as an alternative, we watch the journey. What’s the worth of the journey?

YAMAZAKI: Really displaying this journey is sort of one thing that we shared from the early phases of the enhancing. We needed to share this journey with the viewers.

“You’ll be able to reduce even shorter, however we needed the viewers to expertise this journey—this touring with the characters.”

So positive, you possibly can reduce even shorter, however we needed the viewers to expertise this journey—this touring with the characters. And as you journey together with them we hope that the viewers would really feel some sort of an accomplishment or they went by this journey along with these characters, so that you’re gratified by going by all this touring with the characters.

Then you have got the climax in Hokkaido after which the play ends. Every thing closes. Your journey involves an finish. That’s what we had been attempting to perform by displaying you the driving.

Could I ask a query of you?

HULLFISH: Please!

YAMAZAKI: In Japan, we don’t discuss rather a lot about editors or the significance of enhancing. It’s not mentioned brazenly. There’s not plenty of dialogue in comparison with the U.S. or Europe, and we don’t have plenty of competitions which have editorial awards. Only a few.

And it’s my impression that folks exterior Japan sort of know the significance of enhancing. So my query is—not less than in the uswhat created this essential place of editors? What makes folks perceive that enhancing or editors are essential?

HULLFISH: I don’t know that most people understands the significance of editors. I feel that the Oscars determination to chop out the editors from the reside presentation reveals that.

Additionally I feel that there are lots of American and European administrators who worth their editor and have made statements about how essential the editor is. So when a director says how essential the editor is, then everyone is aware of it.

YAMAZAKI: It’s my impression that we don’t discuss enhancing so typically. So it was a superb shock, good shock, however shocked that I used to be even requested to do an interview right this moment.

HULLFISH: I do interviews with editors. I’ve completed them for eight years. I’ve interviewed lots of of editors, and that’s all I interview. So as a result of it is a lovely movie, I needed to interview you.

YAMAZAKI: Thanks. Thanks.

HULLFISH: Do you know that I’ve a ebook about enhancing that’s been translated into Japanese?

YAMAZAKI: I’ve a replica! I bear in mind when the ebook got here on the market had been plenty of editors who had been excited to learn your ebook.

HULLFISH: Hopefully you’ll be within the subsequent ebook. Azusa, thanks a lot and Naoki, thanks a lot on your interpretation.

TANAKA: You’re welcome.

HULLFISH: Azusa I actually respect your nice knowledge concerning the film and Naoki thanks on your interpretation of her phrases. Dōmo arigatō.